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Offline AresLunthar

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« Reply #30 on: January 27, 2019, 12:10:42 PM »
Exactly.  I simply used +3 fuld easily adjust the power level of the game by have multiple sets of DRs:

Base Difficulty Ratings   Power Level 1  Power Level 2





 




 





Mundane                            (-5)               (-10)
Easy                                   (-3)                (-5)
Average                             (+0)               (+0)                       
Hard                                  (+3)               (+5)
Challenging                        (+5)               (+10)
Heroic                                (+This is what I did with Linear Novus way back when

Offline AresLunthar

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« Reply #31 on: January 28, 2019, 01:19:05 AM »
What might be really cool is having all of the TNs start at 20 then be reduced base on the Racial Package, Culture, Backgrounds and Training Path choices.

You could add a blip to a background saying "the Barbarian Culture respects physical prowess: allocate -3 among CON, DEX, SPD, and STR with a maximum of -2 to any stat" allowing for a culture based stat mod?

Same for Backgrounds and Training Paths?


imported_Rasyr

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« Reply #32 on: January 28, 2019, 05:50:36 AM »
While that is an interesting idea, I think that that would make things too convoluted overall.

I like the idea of making the Average roll be 20-Stat, for each stat. And then the GM can determine which Stat applied to a given skill roll.

I'd still have to rethink the Secondary Stat Rolls a little to see if they would change any (since they should be used for Saves and rolls where a skill might not apply, there needs to be some consideration of what that Average for those should be.


Offline AresLunthar

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« Reply #33 on: January 28, 2019, 11:28:11 AM »
Agreed.  I was tinkering with the Secondary Stats too.  If that becomes the impediment than obviously the change to primary stats is not worth it.  The best I could come up with introduced a new mechanic - and that's not really a solution IMO - I'd rather reduce the "types" of dice rolls.  (The idea was choosing the lowest stat as the TN and the other used as a Bonus vs. it)

imported_Rasyr

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« Reply #34 on: January 28, 2019, 05:44:16 PM »
Well, Secondary Stats have a base TN of 15 for Saving Throws, and that could actually remain the same (with spells and other things keeping their Save TNs as is).


So the only real change would be for skills.

Instead of

skill + stat + roll + Mods >= (TN 20 + Mods)
(which is it currently, we just have the GM determining the Stat at the time of the roll since many skills could work with different stats based on how they are used)

We are talking about changing it to

skill + roll + Mods >= (TN 20 - Stat) + Mods
(this would essentially be sayin "Make a XX Stat based skill roll" which then gives a base TN based on the stat, and the GM would then apply the mods (he doesn't have to state them beforehand either)

The problem here is that Magic and Combat then become the outliers on how they are resolves (because they still use the old methods, though magic could easily be adapted, combat cannot be so easily adapted.

I ran a few numbers for the Elf (the one you posted) against a Kobold, and here is what I got



Elf
DT 20 (15 + 4 Spd + 1/5 rnks melee)
AR 3 (soft leather +3)
Wp Skill 9 short sword (Dex, DR6, Str, +2init), 10 (bow)
Dex 5, Spd 4


Kobold
DT 24 (15, +1/5 melee ranks (+1), 4 SPD, 2 Shield, +2 size)
AR 8 soft leather +3
Wp Short Spear (Spd, DR7, Str,+0init) 9, Dagger (Dex, DR4, Str, +4init)  Light Crossbow 11
Using Small Shield (+2 DT)
Dex 4, Spd 4
Cbt:1H 7
Cbt:Mi 5

Normal
For Elf to hit Kobold - roll 15 minimimum
For Kobold to Hit Elf -- roll 11 minimum

Ok, using Stat rolls as Base

Elf base 15 (this would be a Dex roll for the Elf, due to short sword)
Kobold base 16 (Spd because of Short Spear)

To hit using Stat rolls
Elf has +5 (4 Speed, +1 from 5 ranks melee)
Kobold has +9 (+2 Size, +1 from 10 combat ranks in Dagger, +4 Spd, +2 shield)

To hit under Stat Base

So the TN for the Elf to hit the Kobold will be the base of 15, + the 9 from the various modifiers, for a total of 24
Thus, the Elf, with 5 ranks in Combat, requires a total roll of 19 or higher to hit the Kobold

Now, for the TN for the Kobold to hit the Elf, the Kobold is starting with a base of 16. He then adds the 5 points for the Elf's modifiers, giving a DT of 21 against the Kobold.
Thus, the Kobold with 7 ranks, would require an 11 or higher to hit the Elf.




As we can see from these number, the Elf gets the short end of the stick here.

But that also brought up another thought.

One thing that has always bothered me with point systems is no easy way to limit the number of ranks, so you could end up with some very lopsided characters perhaps. Like a 100 point Kobold who has 7 ranks in Melee when an Elf of the same point value has only 5.

So, I was thinking, of introducing a cap, simple and effective (and it would mean I have to rework a lot of critters).

Simply put you may have a maximum of 1 rank for every 20 points total (CP & XP combined), no matter where the rank comes from.
This will also allow a GM to better gauge the effectiveness of monsters against PC.

How does this sound?

Offline AresLunthar

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« Reply #35 on: January 28, 2019, 06:48:45 PM »
That sounds good.  I do that with Hero System.  I have some thoughts on Magic that I need to formulate.  As for combat, I don't see it as being an outlier because the roll is opposed by someone else's stat.

imported_Rasyr

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« Reply #36 on: January 29, 2019, 03:07:25 AM »

That sounds good.  I do that with Hero System.  I have some thoughts on Magic that I need to formulate.  As for combat, I don't see it as being an outlier because the roll is opposed by someone else's stat.




Heh! I never thought of it like that. Combat is something of an Opposed Roll, combined with an Automatic Roll of sorts on the part of the defender.

The main difference being that it uses a base of 15, rather a base of 10. But would that make combat too dangerous? Or might it encourage more practical tactical thinking?


Offline kenbert

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« Reply #37 on: January 29, 2019, 05:19:08 AM »


So the only real change would be for skills.

Instead of

skill + stat + roll + Mods >= (TN 20 + Mods)
(which is it currently, we just have the GM determining the Stat at the time of the roll since many skills could work with different stats based on how they are used)

We are talking about changing it to

skill + roll + Mods >= (TN 20 - Stat) + Mods
(this would essentially be sayin "Make a XX Stat based skill roll" which then gives a base TN based on the stat, and the GM would then apply the mods (he doesn't have to state them beforehand either




I find that the second method is not very intuitive.  In other games that I have played either the stat is not part of the skill roll or it is added to the skill roll. 

How are you proposing to do opposed skill rolls in Novus 2.0? How would this affect opposed skill rolls?

imported_Rasyr

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« Reply #38 on: January 29, 2019, 05:30:42 AM »


That sounds good.  I do that with Hero System.  I have some thoughts on Magic that I need to formulate.  As for combat, I don't see it as being an outlier because the roll is opposed by someone else's stat.


Heh! I never thought of it like that. Combat is something of an Opposed Roll, combined with an Automatic Roll of sorts on the part of the defender.

The main difference being that it uses a base of 15, rather a base of 10. But would that make combat too dangerous? Or might it encourage more practical tactical thinking?




Epiphany moment.......... Doh!

Rather than base  Defensive Threshold being 15+Speed,  I could change it to 10+Reflexes. This makes it fall in line with other Automatic Skills/Rolls and to me, actually makes more sense over all.

Thoughts? Opinions?





We are talking about changing it to
skill + roll + Mods >= (TN 20 - Stat) + Mods
(this would essentially be sayin "Make a XX Stat based skill roll" which then gives a base TN based on the stat, and the GM would then apply the mods (he doesn't have to state them beforehand either


I find that the second method is not very intuitive.  In other games that I have played either the stat is not part of the skill roll or it is added to the skill roll. 

How are you proposing to do opposed skill rolls in Novus 2.0? How would this affect opposed skill rolls?




As so (currently)



Opposed Rolls
There will often be times where one character or NPC may be attempting something that another character or NPC wants to prevent. One good example might be trying to sneak past a guard who is looking for folks trying to sneak past him.

The simplest method to resolve this is to make both characters/NPCs roll against a base TN 20, adding in all applicable bonuses and modifiers. The one with the highest amount above the TN wins. Failure to get a result above the TN of the task means that you have failed in what you were attempting, even if your opponent in the Opposed Roll also failed to meet or beat the TN, even if their total roll was lower than yours.

Should the roll result in a tie, then the TN is increased by 3 points, and both sides roll again. This being repeated until there is a clear winner.

Opposed Rolls should not be used for things like contests where both participants are trying to hit a specific target, as that is simply a straight up skill roll against an identical TN. One side isn't trying to negate the other's actions.




Yeah, this would require serious rethinking if we went that direction.

Offline AresLunthar

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« Reply #39 on: January 29, 2019, 11:57:08 AM »
In the case of a passive defense the TN for the opposing roll could be 10+ defenders skill ranks (or Insight).  In the case of active opposition it could be 15+ skill ranks.  I know we had rolls before, but these two options reflect other Defenses, and would speed up game play.  Monsters could have a passive & active skill TN in the stat block for example for Stealth & Search (which would be the most common rolls).

If you are talking about an arm wrestle type opposed roll then Athletics vs. STR TN greater degree of success wins, right? 


imported_Rasyr

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« Reply #40 on: February 05, 2019, 10:58:11 AM »

Which background would you choose if your parents are Mages or Alchemists?




I'll have to give this some thought....




Regarding your Fighter Training Paths, its strange to me that you have 2 dedicated specifically to swords but none of the others are paired to specific weapons, except the archer. In your Libram Novus 11, there are quite a variety of lances/spears/polearms, plus there is the advantage of reach beating initiative in the Novus rules. In real life, no army was complete without spearmen. I would recommend having some sort of spearmen/polearms type path. Besides, swords get way too much credit xD




Done.....

Trooper
     A Trooper is a type of fighter who specialized in the use of Pole
Arms.  They specifically train to get the most out of their weapon.
Troopers who travel or work in areas with limited space will prefer
 smaller versions of their Pole Arms than those who operate in
military units.
   Favored Skills (11):  Acrobatics 1, Athletics 2, Combat:
            1-Handed 1, Combat: 2-Handed 2, Combat: Missile 1,
            Healing 1, Riding 1, Search 1, Stealth 1
   Features:
        Armor, Light (3)
        Armor, Medium (3)
        Double Weapon Combat Style rank 2 (5)
        Toughness (+Stamina to base Hits) ( 8 )
        Weapon Training I (3)
        Weapon Proficiencies: Pole Arm (player's choice),
                  Light Crossbow, Short Sword and Dagger (2)
    CP & XP: Gain +35 XP


imported_Rasyr

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« Reply #41 on: February 11, 2019, 06:11:29 AM »

Perhaps I misunderstand the intent of the backgrounds but I'm surprised I don't see backgrounds like mage apprentice or  Alchemist apprentice.  Are backgrounds supposed to simulate what you were exposed to by your parents?




Actually, I would take the scribe background for them, it includes a rank of Magecraft, and specialty in Magecraft (Scrolls)

Offline kenbert

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« Reply #42 on: February 11, 2019, 06:26:53 AM »


Perhaps I misunderstand the intent of the backgrounds but I'm surprised I don't see backgrounds like mage apprentice or  Alchemist apprentice.  Are backgrounds supposed to simulate what you were exposed to by your parents?


Actually, I would take the scribe background for them, it includes a rank of Magecraft, and specialty in Magecraft (Scrolls)




That makes a certain amount of sense. Do scribes get any literacy?

I could also see a background like lab rat.  As a kid you helped mixing potions or grinding components with a mortar and pestle.  Perhaps as a kid to a mage you would help with gathering spell component and the like.  Perhaps all this is a little too specific for your tastes.

imported_Rasyr

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« Reply #43 on: February 11, 2019, 06:44:43 AM »
Ok, I have updated which Training Paths I am going to include (on the first page of this thread).

I have pared it down 4 of each type.

The Skill-based Training Paths have been renamed to Adepts, and the Mixed renamed to Hybrids.

The current list is as follows:



  • Casters
             
    • Cleric
    • Magician
    • Mystic
    • Wizard
[/li][li]Fighters
           
  • Archer
  • Swashbuckler
  • Trooper
  • Warrior
[/list][/li][li]Adepts  
           
  • Bounty Hunter
  • Martial Artist
  • Rogue
  • Scout
[/list][/li][li]Hybrids    
  • Bard
  • Elemental Guard
  • Monk
  • Ranger
[/list][/li][/list]

This gives us a selection, and also includes the staples such as the Bard, Monk, and Ranger, while allowing the Elemental Guard to showcase a character with quasi-magical abilities among the Hybrids.
for the Fighters, We have the Trooper, our Pole Arm specialist, the Swashbuckler for our agile fighter type, the Warrior for the general fighter type and the Archer for a ranged specialist.[/list]

Offline AresLunthar

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« Reply #44 on: February 26, 2019, 11:45:44 AM »
My first browse through the Beta released yesterday: there are 3 classic Subterranean races included (Dwarves, Gnomes, Halflings)and no culture for them.  I'd exclude Urban: Upper and include some the Subterranean.  The stat bonuses are still balanced to a TN20.  Did you decide to keep this?  The DT for some monsters doesn't jive with the player calculation.  A Giant Ant should be 10+8+1= 19 by my calculation.  However, the Giant Rat seems to be OK.  Over-all the DTs seem too high IMO (this is partially because all the defenses and attacks are inflated by the stats).  Haven't quite finished yet.....but, this is the feedback thus far